-

Wed, 27 Oct 2021 13:45:05 +0200

adminsforum@hubzilla.org

Aksel Kies Linc @Hz wrote the following post Wed, 27 Oct 2021 13:45:01 +0200

Frustrated and disillusioned

@!Hubzilla Support Forum
I am frustrated and disillusioned.

I thought Hubzilla was ready for the general public and wanted to introduce it to our local group as a platform, but I guess it's not yet for the normal user or I can't recommend Hubzilla in good conscience at the moment.

The trigger or the drop that made the barrel overflow:
If there is a setting for the user that you can't/shouldn't change ("Do not change the view stream/posts setting ever. Never ever. "), then Hubzilla is not ready for the average user!

I think Hubzilla is a great platform with a highly intelligent architecture worth supporting, but if it is primarily reserved for those who are well versed in IT, then it is understandable if there are few users and Hubzilla is only a fringe social network.

As a communication platform for everyone, I don't think it's useful like that.

Unfortunately, I don't know a solution to this dilemma and, to protect my nerves, I have to withdraw from the discussion.

Farewell.

show all 15 comments

Wed, 27 Oct 2021 14:05:18 +0200

Mario Vavti

mario@hub.somaton.com

A setting which is buried somewhere in expert mode...
#justsayin'

Wed, 27 Oct 2021 14:20:23 +0200

Hans van Zijst

hans@social.woefdram.nl

I do agree that there are lots and lots of things you can configure, and that can be overwhelming for non-tech users. As administrator you should be able to configure things for your users, so that they have good defaults to work with. I would like to be able to configure which plugins are enabled for my users, for example.

But the claim that HZ isn't ready for prime time is a little exaggerated, I think. The majority of non-tech users will never look at settings, let alone those in expert mode. The fact that HZ can communicate with (almost?) every other Fediverse platform, makes it a very good choice.

Just my 2 cents...

Wed, 27 Oct 2021 14:59:46 +0200

Tanja

tanja@hz.lazyteddy.eu

@Mario Vavti Maybe you should have a little disclaimer pop-up when somebody selects expert mode... :expressionless:

Wed, 27 Oct 2021 15:29:56 +0200

Hilmar R (u-zapalot)

hi-u@zapalot.in-eu.net

The consideration is, as a user of Hubzilla, do I want to join a platform in Fediverse to try out the functionalities in such social networks. Then I can register on one of the numerous systems and get a feel for it. Or, do I want to set up, configure and operate such a server system myself without sufficient experience. Then Hubzilla, like countless other software systems in the world, is only manageable after a longer period of practice due to its complexity. The time required for this depends on one's own experience with surrounding software landscapes (operating systems, web servers, databases, network protocols, etc.).

Wed, 27 Oct 2021 16:10:48 +0200

neue medienordnung plus

nmoplus@realtime.fyi

I can understand @Aksel Kies Linc @Hz frustration. I have to admit that I also flinched when I read the warning "Do not change the view stream/posts setting ever. Never ever. ". Just a dream, ideal idea of how to make the magic features of Hubzilla available to the average user with minimum of unpleasant side effects.

the adjustable options, menu items are made available to the user in stages according to his qualification
the qualification can be improved by interacting with the built-in @hbzAssistant
as soon as @hbzAssistant has certified you to have reached the next level, new menu items, features are unlocked

Rudimentary such an assistant - it is called @discobot - is realised on the discourse platform. Here is an example of its use #^https://fediverse.town/ . And I even got my first certificate from @discobot :-).

Wed, 27 Oct 2021 17:39:10 +0200

Aksel Kies Linc @Hz

aksel@social.aksel.at

@Mario Vavti "A setting which is buried somewhere in expert mode...
#justsayin'"

This is the attitude why Hubzilla will never be widely distributed.
#justsayin'

Wed, 27 Oct 2021 17:47:22 +0200

Aksel Kies Linc @Hz

aksel@social.aksel.at

@Hilmar R (u-zapalot) "Then Hubzilla, like countless other software systems in the world, is only manageable after a longer period of practice due to its complexity."

This contradicts the concept of decentralization, i.e. that you can run the server at home ("homeinstall").
Not every "home" has an IT expert.

Apart from the fact that the setting to change "never ever" can be achieved even as a normal user. -> "try out the functionalities in such social networks"

Wed, 27 Oct 2021 18:24:20 +0200

RockyIII

rocky3@im.allmendenetz.de

If there is a setting for the user that you can't/shouldn't change ("Do not change the view stream/posts setting ever. Never ever. "), then Hubzilla is not ready for the average user!

i had trouble with this setting as I put it to "Anybody in the network" and was wondering why post to AP contact where not delivered... now I set it to "only those you specifically allow" and all is fine...

So yes - you have to know what you are doing... and have to be willing to learn about things...

As administrator you should be able to configure things for your users, so that they have good defaults to work with. I would like to be able to configure which plugins are enabled for my users, for example.

Yes - this option would be quid important to have if you want to build up a community

Thu, 28 Oct 2021 07:25:33 +0200

hEARt PhoniX

tobias@hubzilla.rocks

Yes, there is an addon for that, defaultapps, though it is a bit older now therefore I am not sure how it works with the current release. I think it only worked on English language sites.

@M. Dent has written it and as I see he is planning a rewrite, which is not yet available.
#^https://my.hosted.social/wiki/dm42hzaddons/Main/Home

Thu, 28 Oct 2021 09:25:28 +0200

RockyIII

rocky3@im.allmendenetz.de

I believe M. Dent wrote an addon to do this.

yes he did but
https://framagit.org/dentm42/dm42-hz-addons/-/tree/master/defaultapps

i was told that is does not work anymore... will give it a try today

Thu, 28 Oct 2021 09:29:39 +0200

RockyIII

rocky3@im.allmendenetz.de

@hEARt PhoniX just see your post on the wall... did not reach my hub... this forum channel may have some delivery problems

Thu, 28 Oct 2021 10:19:10 +0200

Mario Vavti

mario@hub.somaton.com

Every OS and many apps have settings which an average user will never require to mess with (thinking of about:config in Firefox). Same applies for Hubzilla, it comes with pretty sane default configurations but allows more exotic usecases via custom/expert settings.

In general i think one must decide which tool to use for what task. If Adobe Photoshop is overwhelming, one can try to use MS Paint instead.

Anyway, there is room for improvement in regard to usability for Hubzilla. We know that and i think the situation is constantly improving. It will never be as simple to use as other apps which provide only a fraction of the functionality that Hubzilla provides.

Thu, 28 Oct 2021 10:44:54 +0200

RockyIII

rocky3@im.allmendenetz.de

so just installed https://framagit.org/dentm42/dm42-hz-addons/-/tree/master/defaultapps
but i can´t see how i can configuration it... don´t see it under /admin/addons/

Thu, 28 Oct 2021 10:56:45 +0200

Mario Vavti

mario@hub.somaton.com

@RockyIII this addon is outdated and will need some love to work with current Hubzilla...

Thu, 28 Oct 2021 11:29:03 +0200

Just reading this conversation and feeling like ... a noob again after many years of using hubzilla

where is view stream/posts

I wanted to test and change it. Maybe my administrator hidded this option.

Is it in settings (channel)